03: Detour/Reroute

Andrew and Rocky are faced with a difficult decision as the trail tests more than just their physical ability.

Trail Weight is produced and written by Andrew Steven. Our Story Producer is Monte Montepare. Executive produced by Jeff Umbro and The Podglomerate.

Alexi Pappas’ new book "Bravey" is available on Amazon.

Transcript

Note: Transcripts have been generated with automated software and may contain errors.

Andrew: [Fades in] The way it-- we talk about it in this podcast, and I don't know if I'm stuck-- Revisionist history, but like, um-- Part of this was, you know, like I'm just going to start telling people that I'm going to-- I'm going to do this in a year time. I'm to like, sort of put-- make an inciting incident, you know? 

Alexi Pappas: Oh, I just-- I love the idea of the inciting incident because it's basically saying a goal-- or like it's-- It's creating some inevitability of, of growth or change that sometimes we need. [Fades out]

Andrew: This is Olympian and filmmaker Alexi Pappas. As someone who lives in both an athletic and an entertainment world, I thought Alexi would relate to some of the metaphors I found inspiring while training for this month-long backpacking trip. If anyone could understand how storytelling and screenwriting apply to fitness goals and life goals, Alexi could.

Alexi Pappas: [Fades in] I think it's so wonderful. It's kind of like-- When we start making a film project, or I start thinking about a rate, we talk about the film project as if it's going to happen, even when there's no funding or actors assigned, you know, or onboard. And that's an important way to live, right?

Andrew: Yeah.

Alexi Pappas: And, for you, I love that you created an inciting incident-- And so maybe for people in the world who are not like making a movie or like running a race, like, I mean, you can give yourself a race to-- to like need to get to, but you can also create other types of inciting incidents that are gonna affect you in some way. And you'll figure out how, like, down the road. And I love that you did that. And it sounds like a muscle you've like, grown-- is to create these inciting incidents. And now you've done it again because you've started a podcast—

Andrew: Yeah.

Alexi Pappas: Which is another inciting incident. It's an offshoot of that one. And I just feel like it's a really brave way to live. And it's a way where you're crafting a life and not just like living it. And I think that's very cool. I think that's like-- We don't often do that in adulthood because we don't have to. [Fades out]

[Theme music]

Andrew: I’m Andrew Steven, and this is “Trail Weight,” a podcast about hiking outdoors and the lessons learned along the way. 

We’ll get back to my conversation with Alexi later, but first, back to the trail...

Rocky and I were on the second day of our first backpacking trip. A year ago, we had decided to spend a month outdoors when I got serious about getting healthy. When my Mom died a month into my training, it changed the plans, and I wasn’t sure if we’d ever step foot on the trail. But here we were, the morning of our second day, and the enormity of the task ahead was just starting to set in.

Andrew: What day is it? 

Rocky: Day-- Oh, uh, Wednesday. No, Thursday. It's Thursday? Oh my God, it's Thursday. Eight-- so August 1st. 

Andrew: Yeah. What time is it? 

Rocky: Um, 5:54 [am].

Andrew: And where are we?

Rocky: We're at Rock Creek.

Andrew: Yeah, just outside of the Rock Creek ranger station where we're camping for our second night on the hike.

Rocky: Yeah. [Fades out]

Andrew: We were still getting used to recording these updates, and I was already tired of listening to my voice, so Rocky played along as I asked her questions. Sometimes I can get stuck editing the podcast in my head instead of listening and being in the moment. But here we were, in the forest, 10,000 feet above sea-level, about to hike our first 10-mile day. Today would also be one of our first river crossings, and the guide books all say it’s safer to do this early in the morning because, even in the summer, at this elevation, there’s still a lot of snow. When the snow melts during the day, it raises the water lever and makes river crossing more difficult and potentially dangerous. I wasn’t looking forward to the ice-cold water at ankle level but was sure that was better than frigid water above my knees.

As we set out on the trail that morning, it felt good. Everywhere I looked was beautiful and refreshing, and the night’s rest helped reset me for another tough day. The day before, my breathing was a little strained at times, and I wasn’t sure if it was because of my fitness level, the elevation, allergies, or some mix of all of the above. This is normal, right? This is part of acclimatizing? Not something that derails a trip you’ve spent a year planning.

Rocky: [Fades in]. I don't know, how do you feel about today? 

Andrew: Good. We had, um--

Rocky: Your breathing is okay now. 

Andrew: Yeah. Last night-- The altitude was definitely getting to me yesterday. Today felt a hundred times better.

Rocky: Yeah. 

Andrew: Um, this is the first day where we had good chunks of the trail all alone to ourselves. 

Rocky: Yeah. It was really weird. It was cool. But also weird. 

Andrew: Yeah. We got to talk-- we talked about our lives and our dreams and our hopes. We talked about our families and my mom.

Rocky: Yeah.

Andrew: Who's-- the anniversary of her death is coming up and--

Rocky: One-year anniversary.

Andrew: Yes. And so many amazing views. 

Rocky: Yeah, It's crazy. Met some interesting people. A guy that was--

Andrew: Oh yeah-- apparently was in the woods for 11 days, and we were the first people he saw.

Rocky: He was like, “Take a picture of me so I can show my wife, so she doesn't think I was just at the bar,” and he was like-- after we took the picture and he was like, “okay, now they're going to go to the bar.”

Andrew: [Laughs]

Rocky: I was like, “Okay, dude.” [Fades out]

Andrew: He was at least a day’s hike to a trailhead or parking lot. I guess he could go straight to a bar if he wanted. He went one way, and we set off in the direction of Mount Whitney, the official terminus of the JMT. For many southbound hikers, Mount Whitney’s summit is their end of the JMT—though they still have another 15 or so miles to hike back down from the mountain. For us, we were heading north, which meant Whitney would come at the beginning of our journey. But we’d have to get there first.

The first couple of days of the hike, I experienced the physical difficulty I was expecting, but I wasn’t prepared for this might affect my relationship with Rocky. I knew this journey with Rocky would be challenging. Like any physical endeavor, I knew there would be a certain amount of reliance on each other, and that feeling heightens when you and your partner are sharing resources. Rocky literally had half the tent in her bag, and I had our only stove.

I knew this was something I wanted to do with Rocky—something for us to do together. I knew if we could get through this, it would make us close and more connected and stronger as a couple. If we could do this, we can do anything. I romanticized the feeling that comes after you finish a hike like this together (you know, like the high-fiving at the end of a long race). But I wasn’t thinking about everything “getting through this” entailed.

[BREAK]

Rocky: [Fades in] You’re get to wear headphones?

Andrew: Yeah. So I can monitor the levels. 

Rocky: Are you recording? 

Andrew: Yeah.

Rocky: Oh my gosh! [Laughs] [Fades out]

Andrew: One of the joys of being in a relationship with a podcaster is they'll not only bring a microphone on a thru-hike, they'll also show up in the living room and ambush you with questions.

Andrew: Um, I know on the hike, and in life, we've talked a lot about how we're different. How would you describe how we're different? Like when we're camping or hiking?

Rocky: You underestimate things...

Andrew: Yes

Rocky: I overestimate things. Because nature will kill you.

Andrew: [Laughs]

Rocky: it just wants to kill you. 

Andrew: Would you say I'm more reckless and you're more careful?

Rocky: I don't think you're reckless. I just, I think maybe it's too that like, you'll have a good idea of what we're doing, and then I go-- I blindly trust you and then don't do any research on my own, which is probably-- I shouldn’t do that. Like, so-- but you'll go, “oh, we're doing this hike. it's long, It's hard, but we'll be fine.” And I go, “okay. Yeah, sure.” And then when we get up there, I'm like, “you are a liar!” [Laughs]. Uh-- But it's more-- I think I just-- yeah, so I don't think you're reckless. I don't think you're like putting your life in danger.

Andrew: Yeah. I'm not-- I'm not actively thinking of this, but looking back, I think I can maybe have a “Oh, things are going to be fine” attitude, and I don't think you have that same attitude. Do you? Like, “It'll be fine,” like, “we'll figure it out,” out there?

Rocky: Yeah. I think it's-- it's a matter of being like, uh-- Like if we were driving somewhere, I feel like you would be like, “Okay, where's our destination.” Uh, and you would want to know. Right. And then be like, “okay, we'll be fine.” But then what if I was like, get in the car and drive, and then we'll see where we land. It's a little different. And it's like, okay, are we going to be fine? Like, we're running out of gas [Fades out].

Andrew: After spending a fair amount of time outdoors, I know this is literally true, but it may be a metaphor as well: I'm good at reading a map, but I don't necessarily have a good natural sense of direction.

I’ve learned a lot about myself by being in a relationship with Rocky. We have a lot in common—we love live comedy, making homemade pizza, and talking too many selfies together—but we’re different people with different experiences and different lives. Seeing yourself through someone else’s eyes can lead to discovering new things about yourself you might never have realized before. 

I never understood when Rocky would say something like, “You’re not listening to me,” when we were obviously in a conversation. If I had to recite what she said, I might even be able to get it word-perfect. But I would assume the meaning behind her words, and that isn’t actually hearing what she’s saying. Before I met Rocky, I thought I was a good listener. I probably even was proud of my listening skills. 

But in the same way doing something efficiently is different from doing something well. Reading about a hike is different from stepping foot on the trail. Hearing is different from listening. Knowing how to read a map is different from knowing where you are. If you can’t identify your weaknesses, you can’t change, and you can’t grow. I’m lucky to have someone like Rocky in my life who can help me with this.

Me and Rocky’s journey started years before, ironically just outside of Yosemite National Park.

Rocky: We met at camp. A camp, uh, in Oakhurst, California.

Andrew: It wasn't in Oakhurst, it was--

Rocky: Yeah, it was in Oakhurst.

Andrew: It was outside of Oakhurst, which, Oakhurst is a-- they're, like, town motto is “Gateway to Yosemite.” 

Rocky: Yeah. 

Andrew: You know, we both worked at a camp, so we both at least had a-- a fondness for the outdoors. It was in Yosemite or just-- just outside of Yosemite. Um, like we-- We went on a couple hikes and little outdoor stuff, um, when we were at the camp together, and I just think that's a neat sort of coincidence, for lack of a better word.

Rocky: Yeah, I mean, well, if we didn't work at that camp. We wouldn't have met each other, So-- And that I am grateful for the camp. Uh, we met. I did not like you at first [Laughs].

Andrew: [Laughs] We don’t have to get into that. [Laughs]

Andrew: I didn’t think that story was for this podcast. Maybe it’s another story for another thing, but the short version is Rocky didn’t like me because she thought I was cocky. And it didn’t help that we had met the summer before and I didn’t remember.

Rocky: [Laughs]. But now, now I love you. I love you so much. That sounds so fake. [Laughs] I am stating that of my own free will. Andrew's not holding a gun up to me.

Andrew: [Laughs]. Yeah. We were both on staff at a Christian summer camp, and that's where we met. [Fades out]

Andrew: We bonded over an uneasy feeling, both trying to hold on to what we loved about our upbringing while letting go of the painful and unhealthy lessons ingrained in our souls. Finding someone with a similar reference and perspective helped us quickly fall in love, but even a shared backstory wouldn’t prepare us for everything. 

We moved in together in a small apartment in Los Angeles to our parents’ frustrations, both for choosing LA over their respective cities, but more so, for not getting married. Pursing quote-unquote “entertainment” jobs isn’t easy, and living in an expensive city doesn’t help. We’ve seen each other’s highs and lows many times. Looking back, sometimes it’s easier to see all the hardships and forget to be grateful for the good in your life. When my mom died, it felt like another difficult thing on a mountain of other difficult things. Rocky was there for every long drive to visit my mom, every hard conversation on the ride back. She saw my struggle with how to say goodbye. She supported me trying to figure out what a family is when someone isn’t there anymore.

There wasn’t any grand gesture. Rocky didn’t order a hundred balloons to spell out “I love you.” She did the more challenging and more impactful thing of being present and sitting in the pain with me.

The truth is, it’s hard to be together in a crisis—to individually learn things about yourselves while watching the other do the same, which in turn leads you to learn new things about each other. It’s vulnerable to have someone see you learning. You want people to see you with everything already figured out.

Andrew: Alright, so, what’s in my hands right now?

Rocky: Oh, my trail journal.

Andrew: And, uh, you've given me permission to read some of these, uh, entries.

Rocky: Yeah. I have not read through it since, uh—

Andrew: Since we’ve been back. Since the hike.

Rocky: Yes. Since the hike, because I don't like reading my own writing.

Andrew: So I'm going to read it. [Fades out]

Andrew: Her red notebook was weathered and torn from living in her Backpack, and as I opened the pages, I was struck by the fact that it’s one thing to hear your partner’s thoughts, but it’s another to see them written in their handwriting.

Andrew: Uh, yeah. I just, I wanted to like-- Yeah, I’ll just go ahead and read. So this is from day two. “Stopped to have lunch. Tortilla and lemon pepper chicken. Luxurious. But for real, it's amazing how good food can taste when you're exhausted from working your body so hard…” [Fades out]

Andrew: These were things Rocky was thinking about that I didn't know.

Andrew: [Fades in] “This morning was a little rough. I wasn't looking forward to packing up and doing miles. Oh, and I got sunburned pretty bad, and Andrew and I are already running low on sunscreen. I rubbed mud all over myself to help the burn and to prevent further burning. It's helpful, but I look crazy…” [Fades out] 

Andrew: If only this were the weirdest I’ve ever seen Rocky look. Living in Los Angeles, I got to see Rocky embrace the characters within and shine on stage. Pursing and performing improv and sketch comedy, I got to see Rocky’s humor and creativity come out regularly. An overshared truth of improv is that you need to trust and rely on the people you’re performing with for it to work. If you’re worried about messing up or embarrassing yourself—for fear of retaliation from a scene partner—it just doesn’t work. It’s only through feeling safe enough to try that the magic happens. This is one of the many reasons I love Rocky. Her ability to be vulnerable and push through the pain isn’t easy, but it inspires me to do the same.

Andrew: “Oh well, now that we're halfway through today's hike, I'm feeling more optimistic again. The views have helped a lot with that—such a beautiful place. Fun fact, I still smell [sic] beautiful like Jim Carey from Bruce Almighty. Otherwise, I'd probably spell it wrong.”

Rocky: Oh, I “spell” beautiful. 

Andrew: How is that-- I don’t know--

Rocky: Oh, okay. At first, I thought you said “smell” beautiful, and it was like, what? Uh, spell, so this is a fun fact. Beautiful is a weird word and is hard to-- for me to remember how to spell, but in the movie, he goes “B-E-A-U-tiful.” So it, uh, it broke it down. My sister helped me remember that. I was really bad at spelling, okay. And this helped me get like a, like a, B or C. So...

Andrew: Let's talk about the, uh, sunscreen.

Rocky: Yes.

Andrew: Was this an example of me thinking everything was going to be alright and you wishing I had prepared more?

Rocky: Well, it’s not-- Again, I don't think it's like prepared. It’s-- You thought you were prepared. And I think it's being the-- like, uh-- just one, being-- this is our first, like, long thru-hike. So you just-- you don't know, and you learn from your mistakes. But it's also-- I think you had really gotten into YouTube, uh, backpackers and their advice. And a lot of them are lightweight backpackers. So they are like, oh, you just get like a small, uh, sunscreen. You use it for like your face mostly. And then, uh, your hands or whatever. And I think between the two of us, uh, you know, a small tube is-- is too small.

Andrew: I-- To be fair, I thought this was enough sunscreen to get us through until our next resupply, but...

Rocky: It was a small-- It was very small.

Andrew: Were you upset with me because of that?

Rocky: I mean, I was more-- I think I was more upset with myself. Again, because it was like, oh, Andrew's got this, he's planning it all out. Like I'm, you know, taking the backseat. This is fun for me, and I'm not gonna like, uh, check on anything. And then it's like, oh, I really wish I asked about how much sunscreen, uh, how much, you know-- like looked at that kind of stuff a little more.

Andrew: How much of it was a real concern, and how much of it was just sort of like venting or like getting it out so you could move on?

Rocky: It wasn’t-- it wasn't like a concern. It was more of like, Dang it, we don't have that much sunscreen left, and it's gonna take this amount of time, and we're in high elevation... That's another thing, high elevation, so you get sunburned easier. And then I have like white ass skin, so I got a crazy blister that was like, I feel like-- bigger than like a quarter. What is that? Half dollar size? [Laughs] Why do we measure things by coins? Um, on, uh, my wrist that I still have like a marking from. And it was just-- It was like a-- It felt like an unnecessary, like pain. It was like, oh, if we just had sunscreen, I wouldn't be in pain right now.

Andrew: The first few days, we traced the tree line, over granite and dirt, through forests and clearings. We’d been living most days about 10,000 feet of elevation (compared to an elevation of 300-ft at home in Los Angeles). As we approached the third day, we headed ever higher, searching for shelter from the seemingly endless barrage of mosquitos, wearing nets over our heads like weird bridal veils.

Andrew: All right. Here's-- Here's your journal entry for day three. 

Rocky: Oh boy.

Andrew: We hiked on toward Mt. Whitney—the tallest mountain in the contiguous United States. For many, summiting Whitney is a dream in and of itself. Forget the JMT; Whitney is a bucket list hike for a lot of people. We started the morning early, giving us plenty of time to reach our destination and set us up for a short summit to Whitney’s peak, but by lunch, we hadn’t hiked as many miles as we had planned.

Andrew: “Lunch break.” Oh, there's an exclamation mark. “Lunch break! Last night was tough. There were so many mosquitoes. When I would go to the bathroom, my butt would get eaten alive. The sunburns I collected got way worse too. My wrist by my watch got burned so bad that I got a new giant blister. I should have checked with Andrew how much sunscreen was bringing because it definitely hasn't been enough. Today we're both hiking in long sleeves and leggings to help with the sun. Andrew's asleep against the tree right now. I took off my boots and socks to help with my blisters, and ants keep crawling over my toes. I think we have another five miles to go. So we should hopefully get to Guitar Lake around 5:00 or 6:00 pm.”

Rocky: Am I supposed to say something?

Andrew: Do you have any thoughts on that? 

Rocky: Um?

Andrew: Were you concerned about me at all?

Rocky: Uh, I think this is where I started to, cause the first, like two days, three days, even up to that point, we're pretty like, you know, fine. But then, uh, when we got to, was it Crabtree Meadow? Which I think is what we're going to get to is it's-- I think I started to you-- notice that you, um, were not feeling good. And so it was like, oh boy. And I think, to put it in perspective, I am 5’7” and 120 pounds. Um, and you're a lot bigger than me. And so in my mind, I think it's a similar thing of like, oh, if you were to get hurt, I don't think I would be able to like drag you or pick you up or carry-- You know, I would have to-- I would have to wait with you, which I think is what you're supposed to do anyway.

Andrew: Were you concerned about whether I could do the hike? If I would be in enough shape to-- If I could get in, get in shape enough to do it?

Rocky: Again, I don't think-- I don't know. I don't think I was worried about you and, like, in being in shape. I think if anything, it was the high elevation, and if there were any like, tricky, like, uh, trails or climbing or different things. I think it's ‘cus-- It's like you don't really know how you're going to feel in high elevation until you're up in high elevation. You know, a perfectly fit, healthy person could get up in the high elevation and feel horrible. And so it was more of just like, ah, I don't know. And then, on top of it being heavier, I was worried that like, um, you might struggle with it a little more.

Andrew: I did. 

The reality is that elevation is a quintessential no-control situation. It can affect expert hikers and first-timers the same. Even people who study acclimatization don’t fully understand why it affects certain people. In hindsight, my struggle was probably a mix of being heavy, carrying a large pack, and elevation, plus a few allergies sprinkled on top. But regardless of the why or how, it was taking longer than I’d like to catch my breath.

We reached Crabtree Meadow around 5:00 pm, the time we were supposed to be setting up camp at Guitar Lake, which was still 3-miles and 1000-vertical feet away. Personally, I was frustrated. I spent a year getting ready for this. I wasn’t sure why I was struggling so much. Was it the altitude? Or was I just not ready? I was in the best shape I could have been in, given my deadline, responsibilities, and ability. But I’m not in charge of the altitude. I can’t control the weather or prevent every allergy or cold bug from entering my body. 

I worried my slow pace would put us at Guitar Lake after dark, and each step closer was a step higher in elevation, where the air is thinner and your lungs strain more. I wanted to summit Whitney. I had seen the photos of others triumphantly cheering after reaching the top. I wanted one of these pictures. 

The first three days, we hiked on an approach trail that would connect with the JMT at Crabtree Meadow. Here we met a fork in the road. One direction led to Mt. Whitney, and the other continued on the JMT towards Yosemite. We planned to turn right and camp at Guitar Lake for the night before summiting Whitney and returning back through Crabtree Meadow to continue on to the JMT. Because of the approach route we had chosen, Whitney wasn’t between us and the end of the trail. The only reason to hike the 15 or so miles round-trip and 5,000 feet of elevation gain that led to Mt Whitney was that we wanted to, not because we had to. 

This fork in the road meant that we could skip Whitney. We had a decision to make.

Do we go to Whitney, or do we bypass? Push or no push? Am I tired because I’m just tired, or is this something else, something more serious? Is this altitude or allergies? Is this the end of the trip or a detour?

Rocky and I talked about everything that was going on, the time of day, the tiredness, the breathing, what it would mean to push on, and what it would mean to stay here for the night. The more we looked at the situation, the more apparent it seemed that skipping Mt. Whitney was the right choice.  

[BREAK]

Andrew: All right. Here's the last journal entry. “Day four. Lunch break. It's Saturday, 12:58 pm. Sitting next to a creek and already finished lunch. I find it easiest to write during lunch because we have to let our food digest before starting back up. Okay, update on yesterday. Yesterday was tough. Andrew was having trouble breathing. So we took more stops and went slower. Sadly, we didn't make it to Guitar Lake and instead stayed at Crabtree Meadows, which by the way, is amazing. It's out of a fairy tale. Fish just hanging out in crystal clear water, a giant meadow with soft grass and giant gentle mountains looming over. So it wasn't a bad place to stay. The sad part is that we decided to not do Whitney because of time and Andrew's breathing. I was bummed, but also exhausted, so it was the right call. Better be smart than dead. Now we continue to Tyndall Creek, but that could change. Andrew's taking a photo of me, so I have to act like I'm still writing. [Laughs] [Fades out] 

Andrew: The decision to skip Whitney doesn’t seem like much of a big deal now, but at the time, what made it seem so hard was reconciling the idea of what this hike would be with the reality of the situation. Would this even count? Would this technically be a thru-hike if we didn’t hike such an iconic part of the trail? Yes, we had already been out here for days and would end up doing more miles than the official JMT route, but would skipping this section put an asterisk next to our names on the unofficial scorecard in my brain? 

Andrew: Were you sad we didn't do Whitney. 

Rocky: Uh…

Andrew: Or how did you feel when we were making that decision?

Rocky: I was thinking about you mostly. Like, I was worried, like that-- My brain was going to, oh, this is-- I hope he's okay. Um, and just like the thought too, of like, we were going to be staying at a pretty high elevation, like, camping overnight. And like you had said that your heart felt like it was beating fast and like you were having trouble breathing, and so it was just like-- Oh, this is again-- I think I felt powerless or I didn't have-- I don't have any control over the situation. And so that's always really hard.

Andrew: I was out of breath. It didn’t matter why, and I’m never going to know what exactly caused it. I wasn’t in control. There was no way to deal with it. I had to choose the one thing I did have control over, how I would react in this situation.

I could spend the rest of the hike wondering what it’s like standing atop a peak 15,000 feet high. I could let each day after fill with regrets and what-ifs to the point of distraction. I could let a detour define my happiness, or I could reroute my expectations. This isn’t a story about hiking Mt. Whitney. This isn’t a story about a long thru-hike. If we’ve written the events or endings before we’ve lived them, we’re doomed for disappointment.

So, we stayed in Crabtree Meadow, which might be one of the most beautiful places I’ve ever seen. Nestled near a creek between mountains on either side, the meadow bathed in a golden glow as the sun sat low in the sky. Sure, we had to battle more mosquitoes, but to our surprise, Crabtree Meadow had a toilet. It wasn’t anything fancy, just a hole in the ground with a toilet seat above, walled in on three sides by some corrugated metal. But to our tired hiker eyes, this looked like heaven. 

Alexi Pappas: So, did you backpack-- you had everything with you most of the--?

Andrew: Yeah, we had three resupplies. The-- this section of the-- [Fades out].

Andrew: Alexi Pappas and I talked a little about each of our journeys, and she too had her very own Mt. Whitney-type story.

Alexi Pappas: [Fades in] Yeah, so I ran my first marathon in Chicago in 2018, and I had goals to run this certain time, like an Olympic qualifying time. And I was, um, you know, as prepared as I thought I could be, but basically, you know, five, eight miles into this 26-mile race, I realized that I had just-- not the strength to do the pace that I wanted to run. Like it-- It was just limiting to me. And I knew that I could finish this race, but I knew that I was not going to reach my goal. And it's a really challenging place to be in as a professional athlete because there's a lot of people watching you. There's a lot of expectation, and there's a big break that you have to take after completing a marathon. And so a lot of athletes in my position would have dropped out, and they didn't-- wouldn't want to clock like an embarrassing time or whatever. 

And I remember having this moment where I was like, I know I'm not gonna run the time I want, I know I'm not going to meet my goal or my expectation, what do I do? And, you know, thankfully, I had support on the sidelines from complete strangers as-- as you can find sometimes in marathons and people were so, like, seemingly proud of me in a way that I was not proud of myself in that moment. And I felt like even though I couldn't accomplish my goal, I could still shift and accomplish a goal. So I shifted my goal in the middle of the race to just finishing and doing the best that I could. I think that took a lot of bravery in that moment because you're in pain--

Andrew: Mm-hmm.

Alexi Pappas: --you cannot fathom the next like 12 to 16 miles. Like you just don't, what was it? It was more than 16...

You know, it's easier to choose to step off. And I was really proud and happy that I finished that race, but I did know that it meant reframing my goal. And then later, when the barrage of press and media asks you questions, undoubtedly, they are, you know-- in this scenario, they're like, maybe you want it to run fast. You know, they're leading their questions in a way that makes you feel like you shouldn't be disappointed. 

Andrew: Yeah.

Alexi Pappas: And that was really the harder part, was for me to like, own my new goal and wear it proudly and dictate my own narrative. And I think that's a choice that athletes and everyone gets to make about their own story. But so often, we go with the-- with the one that's set for us. So, um-- and it's not, it's not fun that way. Like I didn't want to stand there after putting myself through several hours of like, pain and bravery and say I was disappointed. Like, of course, I want to run faster than I did, but I was still very proud of accomplishing a goal. Right? 

It's like sometimes we don't-- we can't, and we realized, like deer in the headlights, wow, this isn't going to happen. And then I think we have to immediately make a decision to pivot and to change our goal or to-- you know, it would have been okay if I was like, injured, to drop out and change the goal. But I think to accept the reality, as soon as we know, and then to pivot is smart.

Andrew: When Rocky and I pivoted, we had to own the reality that our hike—our story—wouldn’t include Mt. Whitney. But we still got to write the next scene. This didn’t mean our hike was over.

Alexi Pappas: Yeah, I love this. Like, basically, what you're saying is like, are you watching the story-- the movie of your own life while it's happening, and are you, like, playing along? And that's so fun to think about, and it does make life a little bit more of like a thing we can amuse at and participate in rather than a thing that is just happening and that we're on the-- you know, we're just along for the ride. And I like that. I mean, I do think-- 

Okay, I got-- I think that there's a balance and I, and I-- and I got some advice recently from-- from Bill Hader actually about this. And it really meant a lot to me. He basically was describing his journey and what I took from it was that we need to both be in control and dictate our narrative and also allow opportunities to come to us and pivot with those opportunities. 

And I have like really-- you know, I learned this pretty recently, but I've really taken it seriously because it-- it clearly has worked for him. And I think that it's an appropriate approach to life; to have both. To have like our eyes set on where we want to go, you know, driving towards that inevitability. But also having our eyes up and like, around like, you know, owl-like, and seeing what is available to us. So I think it's, like, somewhat of a balance because if you're too much one or the other, it probably won't work. Like if we're just behaving like a leaf flapping in the wind of like, what-- where's the wind, where's the wind then? Like, we're-- we're never gonna like, have roots, but the opposite of being so stubborn is probably not smart either. So I think it's something in between, right?

Andrew: “Stubborn” is a keyword. On the hike, I was so stubbornly excited to summit Whitney that it’s still something I think about from time to time, today. But I needed to rewrite the story because that wasn’t the hike I was supposed to have.

“I’m a loser,” I thought.

I didn’t want to tell this part of the story, but I felt like I couldn't find a way to have this podcast and not include it. I wanted a better story. Looking back, I don’t even have that much audio recorded from this part of the trail. I think subconsciously, I didn’t want to share what was going on.

Andrew: Today’s really hard. I think I might have like a cold or something. I don’t know? The altitude is making it pretty tough to breathe. And I keep wheezing like I got bronchitis or something. Ugh. It’s the same mileage as the day before but-- I don’t know. It’s feeling-- feeling pretty hard.

Andrew: I was sharing an early version of this story with my friend Monte Montepare, and he wanted to know what was going through my head.

Monte: What about at that point? What did you think the podcast was gonna be about?

Andrew: I don't know. I think I was-- like I knew-- I don't think I had a specific in that moment. I thought it was going to be-- Early on, I thought of the like-- the life-is-like-a-movie framework structure, and I felt pretty good about that. And then, um-- I thought it was going to be much more like, just, this is my story. This is a chronicle of what happened. And I think what it became-- This isn't my story. This isn't just my story. Like, my story is a plot device that keeps the momentum moving. But really, this is like-- This is everyone's story to a certain extent. This is a story about death or loss, or transformation. Like not my transformation, not my loss, not the death that happened in my life, but the-- like the metaphorical versions of all those. 

But in this moment, I think I was embarrassed about not being able to get to do Whitney.

Um, and so as I'm thinking about it now, I'm-- I probably was like shutting down. What is the podcast going to be about? What is this story gonna be about? And if I was about it, it might've been like, how can I not lie, but also not include this part of the story.

Alexi Pappas: I think for me, my expectation has always been more inward-facing. Or that's what I'm trying to do, of like-- I just want to have integrity and try my best with everything I do. And I think what-- what would keep me up at night is if I didn't think I tried my best, or if I was putting myself in a position where, you know, I couldn't try my best which I will admit diddly do if I've overcommitted to other things. 

Andrew: Yeah. It’s like the difference between trying your best and-- and being your best.”

Alexi Pappas: Well, It's just that being the best is so out of your control, right? So, the thing that is in your control, is trying your best. And I think I-- And I think if you do really, really try your best, you'll be able to walk away feeling, like, more confident than any other scenario that it will-- that it will be the best. So it's the best chance at being the best too. But you're right, that sometimes we have to remind ourselves not to, like fixate on being the best, as long as we've tried our best, those that, you know, the rest will come.

Andrew: In a weird unplanned coincidence, the day we were supposed to hike Whitney was August 2nd, the one-year anniversary of my mom’s death. It would have been symbolic, standing higher than I’ve ever been before, on that day, with the memory of my mom. 

We’ve all had moments where we feel closer to the “energy of the universe,” for lack of a better phrase. Growing up, at Christian summer camp, we’d talk about the “mountain top” experience—the feeling that it was easier to be a quote-unquote “Christain” at camp, in the mountains, than it was back home. I don’t know if the literal mountain had anything to do with it, but I felt a real feeling, something special about these places, that made me feel closer to the spiritual world.

I’ve heard about Sherpas on Mt. Everest who pray before summiting, asking for forgiveness, permission, and safety as they scrape the edge of the earth’s boundaries. I’ve read about a Celtic tradition of “thin places,” where the distance between heaven and earth seemingly collapses. 

I don’t tend to think of the afterlife as a literal place above us, but I can imagine the top of Mt. Whitney as one of these “thin places” where earth and sky collide. The idea of being physically closer to my mom while far away from the rest of the world was a beautiful image that I wouldn’t get to experience. But the more I think about it, I don’t think these “thin places” are where we expect them. They’re not on top of the highest mountains or in the holiest of holies.

They’re in the quiet moments of reflection next to a stream while you’re waiting for your water bottle to fill up. They’re in a memory that pops into your head unexpectedly. They’re even found in a smelly pit toilet in the middle of the backcountry. They’re with you all the time if you’re willing to look for them.

It would be cliche to say there are highs and lows on a hike, but it’s true. Frustration doesn’t go away just because you’re surrounded by beauty. Sadness doesn’t go away with time. Backpacking means learning to be ok with feeling multiple things at once.

I have this app on my phone that is supposed to help you meditate. It offers a bunch of stories and recordings narrated by various people on a variety of subjects. Famous actors read stories that are supposed to help you fall asleep. Professional athletes guide you through a pre-game meditation to help with the stress you might feel in your everyday life. If someone wrote one of these guided meditations about backpacking, they’d probably point out that being ok with feeling multiple things at once is kind of the point of it all. Walking miles to these breathtaking places will cause pain in your feet. Sleeping on the floor of a tent is some of the most uncomfortable yet somehow restful sleep you’ll ever experience. And that word “breathtaking” implies both a remarkable feeling of awe and pain. 

At this elevation, we very much had our breaths taken away. We learned how jumping into cold water focuses our attention on the here and now, but that only lasts a moment. Now we were learning that backpacking extends that moment for weeks.

The backcountry is also simple. Yes, we had a resupply schedule and would run out of food if we didn’t get to where we needed to go by a specific time, but everything else in the middle was adjustable. Everything else in the middle was walking. 

We were starting to fall into thru-hiking’s simple rhythm of waking up, walking, eating, sleeping, repeat… A pattern that on paper might come across as mundane, but in reality, is sacred. The almost ritual repetition is monk-like, and the simple task of each day changes the goal from arriving at a location to being present for every step.

Andrew: It is day four, August 2nd.

Rocky: It’s already day four? I thought it was day three.

Andrew: That’s what I meant. It’s day three--

Rocky: Oh, okay.

Andrew: August 2nd--

Rocky: I just went to look at my wrist and there’s no watch there.

Andrew: 7:12 PM. And we are not where we intended to be.

Rocky: Nope.

Andrew: According to the itinerary we should be camped at Guitar Lake. Named so because it’s shape loosely resembles that of a guitar--

Rocky: Not that much. People are just insane.

Andrew: And, um, getting ready to wake up in the morning and summit Mount Whitney. But instead, we are in Crabtree Meadows, which is two miles-- three miles? Three miles south of Guitar Lake. Seven miles south of Mount Whitney.

Rocky: Yeah. I’ve done another 180. Or I’ve just stayed in my place?

Andrew: No I think everyday we each do our own versions of a 180.

Rocky: Yeah

Andrew: Its just-- Its just hard. [Fades out]

Andrew: We started the ritual again the next morning. We made breakfast and made sure to use the toilet at Crabtree Meadow one more time before saying goodbye to Mt. Whitney and setting off towards Tyndall Creek and Forester Pass. 

[Teaser]

[Credits]